Transcript

All Gifts Season 1. Episode 2. Being Mixed in a Black and White World

Note: The All Gifts Podcast is designed to be heard. If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes conversational nuance that's not on the page. Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers and may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.

SPEAKERS

Pandora Villasenor, Mikaela Clark

Pandora Villasenor  00:18

You are listening to the all gifts podcast where we unwrapped some of life's most challenging and painful topics to help you find the hidden gifts within. here's your host, an MBA, entrepreneur, author and Coach Pandora Villasenor. Thank you for joining us at all gifts podcast. I'm your host, Pandora Villasenor. Today Joining me is Michaela Clark Say hi Michaela. Hi, she's a very close friend of mine. And we're going to talk today about a little bit kind of touching on what we shared last time. Last episode, we talked about the Coronavirus and how this isolation, although immensely difficult, has been a gift for me, we talked about how one of the outcomes of the solitude has been finding and owning more of my voice. Today, we're going to build upon that theme with another gift of 2020 the awakening of racial injustice to our collective consciousness here in America. Okay, so let me just give you a little bit of background about myself. My mom is black and my dad is white. They were married and had me in 1974, just seven years after the United States Supreme Court decision to strike down state laws banning interracial marriage. So that's my racial background. Michaela, tell us a little bit about you and your family.

Mikaela Clark  01:45

Yeah, I am the opposite. My mom is white and my dad was black. And I have two older brothers. They're my full siblings. And then I have three older siblings are quite a bit older. They're around like my mom's age. They're my half siblings, and their mom is also white. So we all have like the same complexion.

Pandora Villasenor  02:07

Okay. Yeah, I didn't even talk about my siblings. I have two brothers, one brother. And I have the same father. And then a brother who has a white father and a sister who has a black father. So we're pretty much you know, across the board in our family, so. So my mom and dad got a divorce when I was eight. And my dad went to prison when I was nine. Tell us a little bit like were you with both your family? Like, excuse me, both of your parents growing up? or What was that? Like?

Mikaela Clark  02:36

Yeah, yeah, I was. Yeah, my parents were married. And then when I was 17, my dad passed away. Okay, yeah.

Pandora Villasenor  02:46

My dad passed away, too. I noticed I said earlier that my dad is white. And I didn't think to say was it's sometimes so hard even to still think of him as being gone. But he didn't pass away till I was about 30. I think I was 32 at the time. So yeah. My mom mostly raised us alone. So I think one of the things that I think about when I think about race, when I think about my mom and dad is a story she would tell me over and over, I don't know, my mom was is one of those people like she told you the same stories. But she would tell me about this time when I was three years old, and a white woman complimented my suntan. And my dad didn't correct her. And my mom was actually we were at my mom's job. She was like working at a food stand. And she describes a story that she like, pushed people out of the way. And was like, my baby doesn't have a suntan, my baby is black. Wow. Yeah. And she, she would tell that story over and over again, with an emphasis of, you know, hey, if I'm black, you're black. If you have a drop of black blood, you're black. Yeah. So I don't know. Was that anything that anybody in your family shared? Or would you have any history with? Like, how your parents kind of maybe thrust an identity on you by any chance?

 Mikaela Clark  04:00

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think that. For the most part, we didn't really talk about our race. When I was growing up, I think that there were a couple instances where this I can talk more about this later. But my grandpa on my mom's side, he was racist. And I remember bringing that up to my mom later, there was something that happened in our family, and I tried to talk to her about it and she shut it down. You know, she was like, No, that's not what happened. He's not racist. He was just being tough on you to toughen you up. That was her response. And that was really the only time I remember us talking about race. Other than my dad would say things every once in a while about his experience, but we didn't really talk about it.

Pandora Villasenor  04:51

Mm hmm. I think it depends on your family, right, like, the comfort level and having tough conversations or conversations about tough things. You know,

Mikaela Clark  04:59

Yeah, to be fair, we didn't talk about anything

Pandora Villasenor  05:06

that like, your family doesn't really talk about things that might be a factor. My family talks about everything. And you know, very vocal, you know, I found my mom, I didn't really know where it came from when my mom shared that about, you know, because she was black, I was black, until I went to college and learned in black studies classes that there's actually a law that went back to slavery, that said that if your mom was a slave, basically, any children born of a woman that the kids would take on that mom's racial identity, and it was created so that slaves could be bred, right, so the master could, you know, breed without having to expend any extra cost on more slaves, he could read his own slaves. You know, up until that time in history, the father's legacy is always what's counted. But it changed with American slavery. It was the mom's race that in the mom's status as a slave that got passed on. And so it's funny how, like, my mom would say things as a black woman, and I just thought that was my mom. But there was actually truly a context like a historical, you know, racial context for this in America. So Wow.

Mikaela Clark  06:19

Yeah, that's really interesting. I

Pandora Villasenor  06:21

thought that was interesting, too. So. But yeah, I mean, yeah, we talked about race a lot, I will say, being raised primarily by her, you know, I heard a lot of her processing out loud, what it was like to be black, you know, a black woman, especially a single mom on welfare, raising her kids on her own. So I heard a lot about that. And then, when I was 14, we moved from San Diego where we had been living with just mom, after dad went to prison. We went to Ohio, where my grandmother who I was named after my mom's mom, Grandma, Pandora had a stroke. And so we moved back there. And then I was, you know, thrust into like a whole different world of my grandmother, Grandma, Pandora had 14 siblings, so she was one of 15 Oh, my gosh, yeah. And they all live, like almost all of them live in this small town in Ohio, like, and all of all of her siblings have children. So I have like a gang of cousins, like tons of all different colors, because different cousins married, you know, some married black people, some married white people, but so lots of mixed kids. Just every hue you can think of in the black community is in my family. So they always, you know, were very accepting of me. So I think that was part like part of what fit into my identity of being black is continued to be reinforced by being around my black family. So

Mikaela Clark  07:46

yeah, absolutely. I think I had that experience. I grew up around both sides of my family. I was with the white side of my family more. But we didn't talk about it on either side. And so I just always kind of felt like, Oh, this is what life is like, like, everybody's family must be this way. like everybody's always seeing all these different skin colors. And it's not weird. And I always just felt very accepted and very, I don't know if comfortable in my identity is the right word. I don't think I created an identity because I was like, this is just what it's like.

Pandora Villasenor  08:23

Yeah, I feel like that way. I was trying to think even getting ready for this podcast, because this is such a, an interesting, near and dear topic to my heart right now. I was trying to like go back in time to remember when did I start to feel uncomfortable? And so I do want to talk a little bit about that today. I will say though, my experience is a little bit different in that my white side of my family disowned my dad. There's a lot of things I don't know about in that history that has nothing probably to do with race. But I was told from a very young age that my grandparents did not want to know me because I was black. I never met my dad's dad because of it. I eventually got to know my grandmother. Well, not really. I visited her a couple times his his mom, she was very distant. But that might have been her personality. I know, one relative on that side. My dad's brother and his wife, but not well, you know, they visited us a couple times, they would send birthday cards, but it was always a very distant relationship. So really, my family in Ohio. My black family was all I really knew. So anyway, kind of going back to that identity question. I definitely think that's important. like kind of like, when did we form a racial identity as mixed people as biracial black people? So you touched on that a little bit earlier? Before we were talking before we were being recorded? I'd love for you to talk a little bit more about what that brings up for you when someone asks you What's your racial identity?

Mikaela Clark  09:53

Yeah, I think I pause that that question because nobody's ever asked me that in that way. The way that are the question that My mind went to that I've heard millions of times it feels like is what are you? That's the question that I can't tell you countless times I've been asked that question,

Pandora Villasenor  10:14

man if I had $1 for every time, the Irish woman,

Mikaela Clark  10:19

but that question is so normalized. You know, after a while, I was like, Yeah, what is the big deal about that question? Like people are giving me the opportunity to tell them what I feel like I am more to tell them. Yeah, what I identify as I'd have a different opinion of that question now. But what are you? So when I used to answer that question, this was probably when I was in high school, I always just used to answer like, Oh, I'm black. I don't know where that came from. I don't think I had thought about it a ton. I remember once, I think I was in like, second or third grade. We were learning about Rosa Parks and learning about you know, how she sat in the front of the bus. And I went home that day. And I was like, Dad, like, does that mean, I would get to sit in the middle of the bus like, is that that would work for me? Because I'm having half? And he was like, no. Let me tell you about the one drop rule. Yeah. So I think moving forward from that. I was always like, Oh, I'm black. Because a little part of me remembers having some sort of conversation about the one drop rule you are Can you would have been considered black. And so I think I kind of took that with me. And I was like, yeah, I'm black. And then in high school in college, when I would tell people that they would just kind of like, tilt their head at me. And and wait a couple seconds and be like, and

Pandora Villasenor  11:49

right. Right, right.

Mikaela Clark  11:50

Because they saw my complexion. And they were like, that can't be it. Yeah. Um, so after a while, I just started saying like, Oh, I'm half black, but then I would get the same response. And so when people ask me now I say, I'm half black, and I'm half white, because I'm tired of the follow up.

Pandora Villasenor  12:07

just tired of it. Just let's not get let's just skip the drama.

Mikaela Clark  12:10

Yeah, yeah. But I think for me, my racial identity, I think I probably feel like I'm half black, half white, because I feel like that's such a unique experience. And so that's probably what I identify as, but I identify more with my black side, if that makes sense.

Pandora Villasenor  12:32

Yeah, definitely. I totally like I was giggling over here. I'm sorry if I interrupted you at all. But I'm just, it's so true. I mean, gosh, I just remember so many times in my life, having people ask me what I am. And I think, I think it felt like maybe objectified me, because it's like, what are you not? Who are you? Right? There's something about the word what that just seems like, it automatically puts you into an other category. Right? And you think about all the applications you filled out. And you know, back in the day, there used to be just black and white and other. It's like, nothing made me feel more other than the question, why are you. And then the other thing that I was thinking when you were sharing is, I'm not sure if it was like, all the mix is of all the different things I shared earlier, you know, being raised by my mom, predominantly, from the age of eight, and even before that, her very strong, you know, stance on, you know, my identity, that one drop of black blood that I'm your black mom, and so you're black, or if it was just, you know, a mix of like the early on knowledge of the racism of my white side, or the openness of my black side of my family, but I've just always identify with being black. And yet exactly like I if I say that, so I learned early on that people have a different opinion of me than I have of me. And so I learned early on that, I could say that, and I was going to get some pretty mixed results. And either way, I was probably going to end up embarrassed. And I'm the kind of person like, I don't like to get embarrassed. So I do, I will avoid many things to avoid embarrassment, although I'm coming out of that. And I think part of this podcast is me coming all the way out of that. But I am realizing that when I would self identify as being black, I would get two very different responses, depending on if the person was a white person or a non black person, I should say, and a black person, a non white person, or excuse me, a non black person, predominantly, let's just say a white person, generally, and I know I'm painting a broad stroke here, but generally, the response is like shock. You know, when they find out when I say that I'm black. It's almost like that's like, Well, you know, and like you said, they kind of look at you like, Wait, what? So automatically, you're just put into this category of being something different. So but even if you say I mixed with black and white, which is what I would generally say, to kind of lessen that blow and make it more palatable for that person, there's still that level of surprise. And then they also kind of move sometimes some people move into this, like, sort of pride of like, Oh, I got a black friend, you know, and then there's a lot of, you know, then what they call these days microaggressions that ensue, there's the, you know, wow, like, you bet you're so smart. And you're so pretty, like, I had no idea you were black, or, you know, at my one of my favorites, you know, pulling up next to me to show me how they're darker than I am, because they got that great tan, or the worst, which is, let me touch your hair. I just want to see is it as white as it looks horrible? Yeah, or, you know, maybe more than that, those are kind of maybe even some of the nicer things because even more than that, I think what happened a lot growing up was just isolation, you know, when I was in social settings, because I would be the only person of any color, especially in Ohio, it was very segregated. So, you know, once people found out, it was pretty obvious, you know, in some settings that, you know, I was just treated different, and not really welcomed in I didn't feel like I belonged. Yeah. And then on the other hand, what's interesting is when I've told black people, that I'm black, I have that sort of extra layer of fear that they might reject me, you know, because they have to kind of figure out, you know, am I really black? Like, am I black enough? You know, because like black is more than color black is, it's more its culture, it's, it's more so. So it's like, if I, if I say right out that I'm black, then then there's going to have to be this sort of like skepticism, and now I'm going to have to win them over and show them that I'm really black. versus if I say I'm mixed, then it's, it's sort of like it kind of lessons that again, it lessens that and makes it more palatable for me, not for them, they don't need me to do that. I need to do it, because I'm trying to, you know, stop myself from being, you know, potentially embarrassed and rejected. So, as I've been reflecting on this lately, like, where did this start, I think that's where it started, I just started saying I was mixed, mixed with black and white, so that we can just, you know, kind of maybe shut down the conversation sooner, rather than I'm black and then having to face those different responses.

Mikaela Clark  17:18

Does that resonate with you at all? Absolutely. I was just thinking that it kind of feels like generally going out into the world, I have to have a little bit of a guard up. Especially if we're talking about racial identity and the What are you question? I feel like as soon as I say what I am what I identify with, I'm waiting for comments to ensue. I am waiting to be made fun of I am waiting for people to say I should wear my hair and an afro, why don't I wear my hair curly more often? Or Oh, but you're not black, black? Or like, Oh, your white side is showing like, man? So I've

Pandora Villasenor  18:03

got $1 for that one. Yeah, man, I'd

Mikaela Clark  18:06

be rich to go meet. You're so white. I feel like I've just heard that countless times. So I feel like I always have a little bit of a guard up, especially when that question comes up. Because I'm I'm waiting to be made fun of. I definitely, also hate being embarrassed. But how confusing that is on your identity when you're having to water down your identity for other people. Like that's such a confusing experience. And when you're talking about microaggressions, I totally feel like microaggressions are in place to make you feel like you don't belong. At least I should speak for myself, I've always felt like that. Like, as soon as those microaggressions come out, I have just felt like I have been cast out of whatever group I'm trying to be a part of. It's so isolating, and it feels so

Pandora Villasenor  19:01

lonely. Yeah.

Mikaela Clark  19:03

And I don't think until now I've ever really had this conversation with another mixed person before all of the the racial tension in 2020. And so I was trying to think through like, I should not grow up with mixed people.

Pandora Villasenor  19:18

No, I think it's just hard to talk about. Yeah. I mean, you know, one of the things that, you know, I was kind of doing a little research before this, because I'm like, this is hard to talk about because there's a little sick feeling inside like you don't want to I don't want to portray, I don't want to betray, especially our black community. You know, I think, especially with all the stuff that's happened recently, I want to be very sensitive to making sure that I'm representing the things that I'm saying in a way that doesn't kind of sort of air out our own dirty laundry, you know, so to speak within our community. But where I've landed with that, though, is that it's not really our fault. You know, the American systemic racist structure from the beginning has pitted us against one another within our own community. And so that feeling of not belonging with with whites or non blacks, that doesn't affect me as much I'm much more affected by Wow, I identify with I empathize with, I feel the struggle with, with being black. But I don't always feel that that connection to, to other black people the way that I would like to as I was doing the research, I was thinking back to this stereotype that would pop up in my mind. And so I looked it up again, I went back to this book I read in college called where and when I enter, which is a store, a book by Paula getting's about the history of black women in America, and she talks about and so many others talk about this tragic mulatto stereotype or tragic mulata. You know, usually it's a woman. But it's the stereotype that was used, usually in like literature in the 19th and 20th century, about a mixed race person, like I said, usually a woman who was assumed to be sad or suicidal, because they don't fall completely into the white world or the black world. And this trope was used by abolitionists to create this sort of mixed race but white appearing slave so that they could appeal to white people to want to get rid of slavery. So it was sort of a watered down version of a black person that made people feel sad and made people want to get behind the cause to free slaves. And how that has kind of morphed into modern times is what I was kind of thinking about is, you know, this modern tokenism, I think is still an appropriate term, I think, at least that's what we're calling it in the 90s when I was in black studies classes, but this idea of only using, you know, light skinned, which, of course, you know, hyper high yellow, as we're called, are usually mixed people used by the media workforces to basically say, Hey, we're good, we're good, we're racially equal look, we have a black person. And so they have this sort of, quote, unquote, safe black person to represent black people, whether that's, you know, in movies or in, you know, corporate America. And so I think I don't want to fall into that stereotype. So it's hard to talk about, I don't want to say like, I'm this, like tragic mulatto, that doesn't fit in with the world, and you know, the black or the white world. But the truth is, is that it's been difficult, but it's been set up that way. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Absolutely.

Mikaela Clark  22:35

Yeah, I'm hearing that. I just think about like, mixed race like little girls, and how confusing and damaging that is, I think about how much I've struggled with, like feeling like I don't belong. And it's just so damaging. Like, I don't want other people to have to, to feel that way too, because it bleeds into every part of your life, even if it's at a base of racism or racist ideas, or, you know, whatever it is.

Pandora Villasenor  23:09

Now, you can say no, and we can edit it out if you don't want to talk about it. But you gave me a really good example of this from your college experience. Yeah. Do you mind sharing that?

Mikaela Clark  23:18

Yeah, of course. So I went to Pepperdine. That was six years ago. So I moved from Washington. I got here, I was so scared and young and lonely. And so I really wanted to make friends. Like I was like, how do I make friends? The quickest way possible? I don't know anybody in California. And so I decided to rush I wanted to be a part of a sorority. A lot of the people that lived in my same suite, were doing it. So I was I didn't I don't know, or didn't i didn't know at the time much about sororities or fraternities. I just heard people posing it as like, this is a great way to make friends. And I was like, then I'm going to do it. And so I rushed I was recruited by a sorority, it's called pi phi, and became a part of the sorority and a couple months later, I remember feeling like cuz you're supposed to do all these activities like with your pledge class. I just broke a podcast rule, but I did. I did finger care to

Pandora Villasenor  24:21

insert air quotes.

Mikaela Clark  24:25

And so we were supposed to do a lot of activities together get to know each other, but pledge class of 2018. I think that was and I always felt like I didn't belong. Like I was like, Why do I feel like I don't fit in with this group of people. I feel like I'm pretty easy to get along with you are. And I just I couldn't figure it out. And so a couple months later, one of the juniors I had gotten close to who was white and I think this is another part of the mix experience. I think she felt really comfortable talking with me. about a lot of things, and I think she felt like, Oh, well, you're half white. So I can talk to you about like race. And I can, you know, tell you what goes on in my brain. It was like that comfortability because she was like, but we have this in common. And she ended up telling me that I was only picked to be a part of the sorority for diversity. They, the leaders of the sorority had said, like, okay, we need at least one black person. And so I was that one black person. And so usually when people are picked for sororities, it's because personality wise, they think that they'll go well with the entire group of people. And it was so clear to me, as soon as I joined that, I didn't, yeah. And so when she told me that I was like, Oh, my gosh, that makes so much sense. Yeah. Like, in a sense, I do I belong here. Um, and then fast forward to my senior year, I had decided that I wanted to disaffiliate while they were doing the rush process, and I had decided I didn't really want to be in that sorority anymore. But the President of the sorority came to me and she, well, she actually she texted me this, it was this long text that was like, I heard that you want to disaffiliate, but we really need you in there. We want you to be there so that girls can see that we are diverse. And so that when people come into the room, they feel comfortable. And I think at that point, I was the only black person in the sorority, maybe there was one other? Mm hmm. Um, and so she said that, and I was so mad. Yeah. And I didn't really know what to do with it. I ended up sending her this long message back. I don't even remember completely what I said. But I remember saying like, hey, this isn't the first time that I've been asked, or that I've been told that I'm a part of this group, solely because of my race, like you're boiling me down to a statistic. And I'm a human being. And I think I said something along the lines of like, but it's, it's gonna take more than me in a room for it to seem like this group is diverse.

Pandora Villasenor  27:12

Take a little bit more than that. It's gonna

Mikaela Clark  27:14

take more than even a handful of colored people in a room for people to come in and feel like it's diverse.

Pandora Villasenor  27:21

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I, you know, it's interesting, because, during, you know, the aftermath of George Floyd and all the events of 2020, that led up to George Floyd, actually, all the events of the past decade, actually, all the events of the past century. George Floyd, you know, I was having like one of these talks with, with a friend of mine, a black woman. And she said, Well, you know, but you get to be one of the safe black people, you know, like, you've had privilege. First of all, I was a 15 year old mom on welfare, that has dealt with, you know, a meth addict for a parent and a heroin addict for a parent, the oldest of four, who took care of everybody who's been homeless, and all sorts of things. So I didn't grow up with privilege. So I think, though, the misconception is, is that what you experienced is privilege, that somehow it's a privilege to be targeted as a token of your race. Yeah. And it's not it feels alienating. It feels yucky. I've been in similar situations, I couldn't even name it when I was younger, because I didn't understand. I would just be in social settings and under and I couldn't understand, like, Why do I feel so uncomfortable here? Mm hmm. Why? Why do I feel so embarrassed and ashamed? Why? Well, if I didn't know it, but I was in predominantly white settings, probably I was the only person of color and, and it was obvious, and I was treated that way. So but you know, I got invited to be there so that everybody looked good, you know, and whether that's a place of work, or a place of worship, it doesn't matter. It feels like crap, especially if it's a place of worship, that really doesn't feel great.

Mikaela Clark  29:05

Yeah, absolutely. I have such a hard time with the notion that like in that experience, specifically, that that's a privilege to have been invited to be a part of this group. Because, you know, by the end of college, I was struggling with severe depression.

Pandora Villasenor  29:24

Yeah, social anxiety, which I don't think that being a part of a group that I felt like I didn't fit in and at that point knew that they saw me as for my skin tone that they saw me as the the diversity pick. I don't think that that had very many benefits to it. Now. I know. And that's the misconception that I think it's nice to talk about amongst black people to be able to say no, what you see is privilege actually has been very harmful for me. Yeah. So let's say it's the privilege of I've been thinking about this a lot. Let's say it's the privilege of I go to a job interview. I don't disclose in the job interview that I'm black. Because who does that in a job interview, you're not sitting in HR, it's just not HR appropriate. You don't just sit there and go, Hey, while I'm here, let me just break down a couple of demographics for you. It just doesn't come up just for, you know, regular, professional, appropriate reasons. So, you know, I get into an organization, this has happened countless times I get into an organization, they don't know my color. But soon enough, they get to know me, and they realize right now did Am I in a place of privilege, because they went ahead and hired me because they didn't know absolutely, I don't deny that there are times when it's probably going to work to my advantage in the beginning, yeah. But then once they know me, or once they start to, you know, engage with me and they learn, that's when isolation begins, that's when I start to feel different than everybody else. That's when I'm the one person at the sales meeting, that's, you know, the odd person out, doesn't get the jokes. And even if White people aren't overtly racist, there's just a degree of like, they know, stuff that I just don't like, I didn't grow up vacationing. I remember one time I had this white friend, lover to death. And you know, she got around another way, friend of hers, and they were talking about St. JOHN, St. John's or something like that. It's a clothing brand, apparently. And they were just going on and on. And I'm like, What are you guys talking about? I don't who's St. JOHN, you know, why? It's you don't know. It's like some brands, some boujee? like white brand? Like No, I don't know, like, at that point, I hadn't even been, you know, outside of my bubble of, of learning about those kinds of things. So whether it's a brand name, or you know, their ability to play certain sports that I didn't have access to, or there's just so many things around like, I'm thinking mostly of workplaces, there's just so many things that white people know about that I just have no clue. So even if they're not overtly racist, there's just that sense of like, I don't belong with these people. I have no idea what they're talking about. That would be like one of my experiences as well. So

Mikaela Clark  32:00

yeah, absolutely. I remember being in high school, and I had just started crew rowing. And I was like, 12, or 13. I was really young. And I it's a very white sport, very wise.

Pandora Villasenor  32:15

I'm gonna say, I don't even know what you're talking

Mikaela Clark  32:16

about. So I started on this team, and everybody was wearing Lululemon. And I had never heard of the brand before. I mean, I was pretty young, too. Yeah, um, but I just wanted to fit in so bad that I remember every chance that I had, I bought something from Lululemon every time I, you know, had saved up enough money or for my birthday. That's what I would ask for. Because I just wanted to fit in so bad. I was like, wearing my Nike, but like, that wasn't the brand that all the white kids were wearing. Nope. And I didn't fit in because

Pandora Villasenor  32:49

I couldn't even pronounce Lululemon. The first time I saw it. I don't even know what that word. I hate to turn into like a more, you know, pressing matter of the day, but I am just so curious about the events of 2020. And just how, like, how has it and it's okay, if it hasn't, but has it awakened? Anything in you hasn't brought about any changes? The whole point of this podcast is to talk about like, the gifts, because I think there's tons of gifts in the season, even within the very bad things. So I'm just curious, is there anything that's on your heart to share about like, how 2020s affected this whole thing for you?

Mikaela Clark  33:27

Yeah, absolutely. I think, at the very beginning, when George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery, when they were killed, when I saw that on the news, I was kind of like, what's happening again, you know, that was kind of my, my attitude towards it. And I'm kind of ashamed to say that, but that's kind of how I looked at it. Um, and then it felt like, all of a sudden, there was an uproar. And I was like, wait, why? Are we actually talking about this man? Yeah, we can, we can talk about this. And we can, there are protests and it just, my mind was like, okay, we're doing this, like, we are going to tackle this, and we better do it. And we better talk about

Pandora Villasenor  34:11

it. Yeah, there's a whole, like, belief that well, if you're not talking about it, then, you know, silence is violence, right? Yeah. Right.

Mikaela Clark  34:20

Um, so that was my attitude at first. And then kind of quietly at first, I was like, really trying to educate myself on on exactly what had happened. I started researching a lot of history. And was just trying, I realized, like, Oh my gosh, I've never really, I don't know that much about black history. And I don't know a lot about like my own heritage and my own culture. So I started doing a lot of research but wasn't a part of a lot of conversations because I felt so afraid that I was going to get into a conversation and get over my head, get it over my head and not be able to be Got my claims. I started reading books and doing a lot of research. And then at work, they actually started having a ton of conversations. And they called them open forums, the VP of my division started having a lot of open forums. And so we had one open forum, which was maybe a week after George Floyd was killed. And she got on the call and just said, like, Hi, I just, I want people to know, there's a safe space, you can come here, and you can talk about your experiences, and I just want to hear how everybody is feeling. Um, and though it's a, it's a pretty diverse group of people, I think there's like two or three black people on on a team of 30. And so she was like, I'm gonna go on mute now. Um, so I just want you guys to share your experiences and share a little bit about how she was feeling. But she was like, mostly, I want this to be a place for you. So she went on mute. And for like, two minutes, it was silent. Nobody said anything. And my heart started beating really fast. And that's kind of my telltale for myself. If I'm in a meeting, or I'm in a group where they're asking, does anyone want to share anything, if my heart starts beating really fast? That means there's something that I should share? Yeah. And so I unmuted and I was like, Hey, guys, actually, I would really like to share about my experience. And I talked about some experiences of racism I had had at a different job and different microaggressions. And I just mostly did that to break the silence. And once I muted myself, again, people got on got on the call, and they were like, Okay, well, since you you set all that, can we ask you like, some question? Someone was like, um, you know, if I want to talk about like, if I want to talk with my friends about the current events, and what's happening in the world, how would you suggest I do that? I kind of became like a resource. And I didn't really know what to do with that. How did that make you feel?

Pandora Villasenor  37:13

I didn't really know

Mikaela Clark  37:14

what to do with it. I answered her question, because we were in a call of 30 people. And I was like, I don't want to be rude. But following that, I definitely had to put some boundaries in place. And maybe I didn't do it so outwardly. Because I think it's great for people to ask questions. And to be curious, but I think I said on another call, like, you know, it's great that you want to know that you want to ask questions, but it's really exhausting. Yeah, to be the person answering all of those questions. So please look it up online or read a book. There's

Pandora Villasenor  37:49

so many resources out there really good books. You know what, I can get a book list for you? Yeah, I'll tag you on Instagram, with books.

Mikaela Clark  37:59

So I went on a tangent there. But that kind of sparked for me the like, Oh, my gosh, I have a voice and I actually have experiences of racism that I've never thought about that I've never processed, never processed, because I never felt like I could write it just kind of felt like okay, you're gonna take this on the chin and keep going through life. And so that, that kind of I felt really empowered by that. Like, I was like, No, I have helpful experiences to share. And it's okay for me to share those experiences. It's okay for me to process my feelings. And like, I actually have a voice here. And so I think that's probably been I care about pretty original question about

Pandora Villasenor  38:44

how it all affected you this year? Ah, yeah, doing great.

Mikaela Clark  38:48

I think that's probably been the biggest effect for me was, I just felt really empowered at the same time. I was so sad. I was too. I was so sad. And it was really overwhelming, especially hearing about like, Elijah McLean that had happened a year ago that I sort of, I remember hearing about it kind of like reading a news title about it. But then hearing and watching the videos of that and reading the articles about all of the instances of police brutality and racism that haven't gotten press. It just feels like everything was being dug up and resurfaced. And that was really challenging. I just felt so heartbroken and helpless at the same time. It was really hard for me to feel like, like things are going to get better.

Pandora Villasenor  39:54

Yeah, I'm still grappling with that. I I remember, um, you You know, there's a lot that happened just a few years ago, right with, like Trayvon Martin and even like, how Kaepernick was treated, you know, when he took a knee, like the public criticism and the way that that, that he was treated. I mean, those wounds had just begun to scab over, and then suddenly, you know, in the middle of being rocked by Coronavirus, we're all raw, we're isolated, where the future is uncertain, we have no idea what's going on. We don't know if we can trust the media. And suddenly, I mean, I say that because, you know, there's just so many different opinions out there. And then suddenly, you know, I see, you know, one day I'm scrolling through, you know, and I see this video of Christian Cooper and Amy Cooper. Yeah. And there's something about that video, or something just clicked inside of me. That was earlier the same day. So that clicks first. And I think, you know, and the only way, the only thing that would come to my mind when I think about it is how she'd weaponized her whiteness. And I thought about how many times I've been in experiences where I've seen that, where I felt that where I've experienced that where I've been with family members, and, and somebody did that to us, whether in a, you know, a public setting in a store, or a restaurant or our neighborhood, or school at school. There's it's terrifying, powerless situation. So I see that and I and it just brings up like this huge surge of motion to me, but I push it down, because I'm working. So I go back to work, I just keep you know, put the phone down, stop scrolling media, just focus on work. And then over my lunch hour, I decide to go for a walk. And that's when I saw and heard about George Floyd. And I'm going for a walk with a friend in the neighborhood. And she's sobbing, so a friend of mine sobbing, and she looks at me and she's like, why aren't you sobbing? And I was literally, it was as if, like, I was so numb. And there was this part of me that knew that like, once I started to sob, there would be no end to the sobbing. Yeah. Because what I told her in that moment, in a very weak voice, because I don't even know how I could even get it out in a moment. I said, This happens all the time. Yeah, that's all I could say, This happens all the time. I told her, the only difference is, is we're now seeing it being recorded. What about the countless times these things haven't been recorded, things that happen everyday things that have happened every day since the beginning of America. And, you know, it just brought back so many old memories. During this time, I also, you know, had became aware that one of my sons had been literally in four different situations where police have had guns in his face, for just walking around in the dark, because he's like, that kind of guy. He's quiet, and he likes to go for walks, and he likes to get out and think. And for different times in his life, he has been brutalized by police. I never knew that my son could have died. You know, and you think about that, in the context of all the things that were coming to light. It wasn't like a surprise. But it was like suddenly, you know, with everybody talking about it was like all these old and old ones were opening up new wounds were forming. And I was just an open wound, I was just so upset, so so in pain, so you know, it's just during that time. So again, I talked about this in the last podcast, the gift of 2020 has been, you know, really going inward with these things and being able to really land on and really process and go, No, I have feelings about this. And the thing in particular that sparked this conversation is an Instagram post we both saw, you know, anybody can go on Canva and create an Instagram post that looks really official and light skinned black woman probably mixed had posted something about Hey, hey, mixed people stand down. This is not your fight. This is not your struggle. Let the darker skinned black people speak, let their voices be elevated. And I am all for black voices being elevated. But what really hurt in that moment? Is it kind of put a voice to that, that rejection that I was talking about earlier? And and that's when I said no. Don't tell me to stand down. Girl with Canva who puts your four points up and acts like your official? No. My sons have been threatened. Our sons are being threatened. Our sons are being killed as we're recording this podcast. Just this week. We heard about another shooting thank God, Jake Blake is alive, but paralyzed and his children witness that. Yeah. So my gift of this season. Obviously this whole thing is not a gift. But I want to look at what can I get out of And I think the thing that I'm getting out of this is, I am going to say my identity. So during this whole aftermath of, of George Floyd and all in all the other events, Ahmad and, and Christian Cooper and everything, there was an Instagram trend that went around with, you know, people saying, Hey, I'm a black woman. And I posted that day, hey, I and I said, contrary to what you may think, when you look at me, I'm a black woman, and I'm proud. And that's who I am. And that's what I'm going to say. And it's okay, if, if you have an identity, or any mixed person has that identity, I'm black, and I'm white. But for me, I have identified with being black, but I have said, I'm mixed, to make other people feel more comfortable. And I think the gift of 2020 in a larger context is I'm just not doing anything anymore. Just to make other people comfortable. I want to love people, and I want to help people. But the best way I can do that is by being my authentic self, and sharing who I am, so that other people can hopefully be inspired by that. So the gift of 2020 is, I am going to say that my identity is being black, hey, we're in a day and age where people can say what they identify with. So, hey, I am not gonna let anybody take my blackness away from me anymore. So yeah, do you have anything else that you feel like, would be like just a gift from the season?

Mikaela Clark  46:24

Yeah, absolutely. So this is going back to something I said at the very beginning of the podcast, but I was talking about my grandpa, on my mom's side. So I had also said that, that I had felt very accepted by the white side of my family. And I thought that's how I felt until I think I was about 15, or 16. And my grandpa decided to give all of his grandkids, all of us cousins, a gift, he was going to give us a gift for Christmas. And it was a large sum of money to go in. I mean, well wasn't that large. But at that time, it was large, probably

Pandora Villasenor  47:08

felt large to you. Yeah.

Mikaela Clark  47:11

That was going to go into our college funds. And he had kind of he had prefaced it like that, like, that's what it was going to be like, please put this towards your college fund for your future. And I remember all of us cousins, like he gave us his envelopes, and we opened it up to see the checks. And we realized that me and my two brothers had been given exactly half of what he had given my white cousins, oh my gosh, which was just such a statement. And really felt like a huge hit to my self worth. And I remember not really knowing how to process that. So I never did. But that was an experience that came up this year, when I was thinking about what I talked about, you know, I think that that feeling of feeling empowered, was a big gift of this year. But when I was, you know, feeling really empowered about like, No, I have experiences, I thought of that experience. And I thought of how I thought of all his treatment of me and realize, like, Oh, my gosh, he was always really hard on me. And he was actually always pretty mean to me, especially compared with my white cousins. And so when I was thinking through those experiences, I started to realize that the voice that I hear in my head, in part comes from my grandpa, telling me that I'm not enough telling me that there's something inherently wrong with me telling me that I don't belong. And I realized that that had really become a part of my internal dialogue, because my own grandfather treated me that way. And so but I think a gift that comes from that, is that now I really, I really feel empowered. And I am saying, you know, no, that's not true. And my self worth doesn't come from you. It doesn't come from your opinions. And this is me specifically speaking to my grandfather. In he passed away a couple years ago. So speaking to him, yeah. In my mind, what I would say to him, yeah,

Pandora Villasenor  49:23

voice in your head. Yeah,

Mikaela Clark  49:24

yeah, yeah. Or stomping down that voice in my head to say, No, no, you're not right about me, I do belong, I am worth it. I am worthy. And you cannot tell me otherwise. I think that's been a huge gift. Because I didn't realize how much that affected so many different parts of my life. And so I would say that that feeling empowered and then also, you know, learning that I am not shaped by others opinions of me. Yeah. And then specifically learning how to tell that voice in my head. had to shut up. You're not right. Those have both are all of that has been huge gifts.

Pandora Villasenor  50:07

Beautiful, that's beautiful. And that's really what my gift really is to because it's more than just being able to say, Hey, this is my identity. Because saying those words is somehow important to the world. No, it's what it is, is being able to say, my opinion of myself doesn't like you don't dictate my opinion of me. I will not let other people dictate my identity. Yeah. And so it isn't empowerment. It's a feeling of and this is what's so beautiful about this time. And I know that this time has been difficult to it's continues to be difficult. I mean, we're six months and locked down here in Los Angeles. So it's been very challenging. Like, I want to get my eyelashes done. Like so challenging. No, I'm kidding. There's so many other more serious challenges. That was a joke, although I really want it true, but also true. But yeah, it's just this sense of like, and I hope whoever's listening to this, that we inspire you to like, find your empowerment during the season. Like, this is the time for us to really go inward. I think the isolation I talked about this last podcast, the isolation is really an opportunity to detach ourselves from what other people's expectations are of us, other people's identities for us, we can really start to like, go inward and see like what that inner wisdom for me, I call God, I think God can really help us see who we really are. And it's a beautiful thing we are, we're beautiful people, and no matter who we are. And so the more we listen to outside people, I mean, they're their filters are faulty, they don't, they're broken, we're all broken, right? So if we, if we impose our own viewpoints on other people, our own filter and of who they are our own perception, it's already coming from a faulty place. So who am I to say, you know, who you are supposed to be? You know, so anyway, it's been a beautiful season, all in all, even with all the things So, thank you so much for being here. Mikayla. I love you so much. And I love sharing your story. So thank you.

Mikaela Clark  52:17

I love you, too. I'm so honored to have been here. Thank you.

Pandora Villasenor  52:24

Thank you for listening to the all gifts podcast. I'm your host Pandora Villasenor. I have a passion for coaching people to overcome the challenges in their lives by helping them discover ways to transform those challenges into gifts, gifts of accomplishment, perseverance, strength and resilience. But most of all, peace and self love. Loved ones go to www.all giftsbook.com to join us for exciting updates on the launch of all gifts the book and sign up for our free newsletter.